Once a criminal, always a criminal?

[Jazzy]

About 68 percent of 405,000 prisoners released in 30 states in 2005 were arrested for a new crime within three years of their release from prison, and 77 percent were arrested within five years, according to a report by the Bureau of Justice Statistics (BJS) released Tuesday.

The report, entitled Recidivism of State Prisoners Released in 2005, is based on a BJS data collection which tracked a sample of former prison inmates from 30 states for five years following their release in 2005.

According to the report, prisoners released after serving time for a property offense were the most likely to recidivate, or relapse into crime. The report also found that recidivism was highest among males, blacks and young adults.

Within five years of release, 82 percent of property offenders were arrested for a new crime, compared to 77 percent of drug offenders, 74 percent of public order offenders and 71 percent of violent offenders, the report found.

Public order offenses include weapons offenses, driving under the influence and other miscellaneous or unspecified crimes..

Regardless of the initial incarceration offense, the majority, 58 percent, of released prisoners were arrested for a public order offense within five years of release. An estimated 39 percent of released prisoners were arrested within five years for a drug offense, 38 percent for a property offense and 29 percent for a violent offense.

The BJS report did find that recidivism was higher among non-violent offenders, however, it also found that about 10 percent of convicted murderers released in 30 states in 2005 were arrested within 6 months, and about 48 percent were arrested within five years.

Out of all violent offenders released in 30 states in 2005, about 33 percent were arrested for another violent offense within five years of their release.

Source

Is the system broke or is it that people just can't change?

 

[Nebulous's iconNebulous]

Most of those people are probably felons and can't find job have limited options in other aspects of life too, maybe if we gave reformed criminals more opportunities, they'd stay on the right path?

 

[Jazzy]

Everyone is a criminal, just because you don't get caught doesn't mean you never committed a crime in your life... I'm sure you all jaywalked or had sex using an illegal position...

This thread is about those who did get caught and the percentage of recidivism. I agree with Nebulous that most of these released prisoners are probably felons and unable to secure work due to their felon 'status'. Is it fair? Maybe, maybe not. It depends on the type of felony committed and if they're already repeat offenders.

Some people can turn their life around but according to the percentage of recidivism, most can't or won't.

 

[DrLeftover]

Because of the economy...

Even clean people are doing things that they wouldn't have due to being desperate in times... but some love to do crime or that's all they know...

Such as your local Congressman.

Right?

Tell me I'm lying.

 

[WHO IS SERAFIN]

Most of those people are probably felons and can't find job have limited options in other aspects of life too, maybe if we gave reformed criminals more opportunities, they'd stay on the right path?

That is a great thought but I have a business and if I sub contract out that is the last person in the world I am going to risk my hard earned reputation through. My hard work over the years and following the law is hiring a ex convict to risk all that. Now if I ran into a type that took on the government like the Bundy ranchers I would put them on the top of my list to hire if they could do the work.

 

[Nebulous's iconNebulous]

Most of those people are probably felons and can't find job have limited options in other aspects of life too, maybe if we gave reformed criminals more opportunities, they'd stay on the right path?

That is a great thought but I have a business and if I sub contract out that is the last person in the world I am going to risk my hard earned reputation through. My hard work over the years and following the law is hiring a ex convict to risk all that.

You run the same risk with anyone you hire regardless of their criminal record. Bad people come in all shapes and sizes and some of them just haven't started behaving badly yet or never got caught in the first place.

 

[DrLeftover]

Even a werewolf deserves a second chance.

But after that.....

 

[Jazzy]

I can see the reluctantcy some potential employers would have hiring a felon. It's not about how hard they might work. It's about being trustworthy. In the eyes of a potential employer, the felon is not a law abiding citizen. Do they want to take a chance hiring a felon when there are law abiding citizens going after the same job opening? I would say the chances of the felon getting the job are pretty slim.

 

[DrLeftover]

It really depends on the job we're discussing.

Should a felon be hired to be a bank teller? Probably not immediately after vacating the old Hotel Graybar.

But can they be trusted to, say, do roofing? Yes, and I know several that did exactly that, one of whom ended up as foreman on his own crew after a year or so.

How about working behind the counter at a pharmacy? Maybe not.

Would I hire another ex-con to resurface my driveway? Well, not directly, but the guy I did hire had one working for him.

 

[Sinon]

It really depends on the job we're discussing.

Should a felon be hired to be a bank teller? Probably not immediately after vacating the old Hotel Graybar.

But can they be trusted to, say, do roofing? Yes, and I know several that did exactly that, one of whom ended up as foreman on his own crew after a year or so.

How about working behind the counter at a pharmacy? Maybe not.

Would I hire another ex-con to resurface my driveway? Well, not directly, but the guy I did hire had one working for him.

To add to that, I'd take into consideration the type of felony they had committed. i.e if they had committed violent crimes, I probably wouldn't hire them to be a part of my building firm where tools are readily available. Similarly if their felony was theft, I wouldn't want them as a cashier

Regarding the original question, my answer is "sometimes". I do believe that criminals are more likely to commit crime again. Will they always commit unlawful acts? Maybe. More likely yes than no. But not always.

 

[WHO IS SERAFIN]

Most of those people are probably felons and can't find job have limited options in other aspects of life too, maybe if we gave reformed criminals more opportunities, they'd stay on the right path?

You run the same risk with anyone you hire regardless of their criminal record. Bad people come in all shapes and sizes and some of them just haven't started behaving badly yet or never got caught in the first place.

Maybe and maybe not. But you can imagine how fast I would go out of business if I let a known felon work around someones home and he stole something or hurt someone or committed any crime on that property. I and my family come first over everything and everyone and no way am I risking such a act.

 

[Nebulous's iconNebulous]

Most of those people are probably felons and can't find job have limited options in other aspects of life too, maybe if we gave reformed criminals more opportunities, they'd stay on the right path?

You run the same risk with anyone you hire regardless of their criminal record. Bad people come in all shapes and sizes and some of them just haven't started behaving badly yet or never got caught in the first place.

Maybe and maybe not. But you can imagine how fast I would go out of business if I let a known felon work around someones home and he stole something or hurt someone or committed any crime on that property. I and my family come first over everything and everyone and no way am I risking such a act.

Same could happen with an employee with no criminal record.

 

[WHO IS SERAFIN]

Most of those people are probably felons and can't find job have limited options in other aspects of life too, maybe if we gave reformed criminals more opportunities, they'd stay on the right path?

You run the same risk with anyone you hire regardless of their criminal record. Bad people come in all shapes and sizes and some of them just haven't started behaving badly yet or never got caught in the first place.

Maybe and maybe not. But you can imagine how fast I would go out of business if I let a known felon work around someones home and he stole something or hurt someone or committed any crime on that property. I and my family come first over everything and everyone and no way am I risking such a act.

Same could happen with an employee with no criminal record.

True but I am much more likely to be forgiven for a bad employee that had back ground checks then hiring a known felon.

 

[WHO IS SERAFIN]

From my experience, felons sometimes can be more trustworthy than people that have no criminal record... For a lot, they just want to work hard and go home... Just because someone has no record doesn't mean that person is trustworthy...

Probably true. Dont know what the solution is. Just know I would never take the risk and hire one. Maybe something like after so many years depending on the crime the felony charge gets reduced. And then after more years of no trouble with the law it gets wiped clean. Like a 10 year proof of being a good citizen.

 

[Jazzy]

Some criminal records can be expunged and some can't but even if they do, the criminal record is never totally 'wiped clean':

Expunging Records
In order to expunge a criminal record, the convicted individual must petition the state criminal system to seal or destroy records of their arrest, conviction, detention or time served. Each state has different laws and a slightly different process for expunging criminal records. Misdemeanors and petty offenses are relatively easy to get expunged from one's records.

Requirements and factors for expunging records include: time period between incident and expungement request, no current criminal investigations or incidents, number of priors, no convictions during waiting period, completed probation from conviction completed free of new criminal incidents, and completed terms of the sentence and/or served time. All of these requirements factor into the acceptance or denial of an expungement petition. Basically, the court system wants you the petitioner to demonstrate that they are fully rehabilitated. Depending on the type of felony and from which state the crime was prosecuted, many seek the help of a lawyer to take care of the formal paperwork and proceedings.

If you are acquitted of your charges, or win in appeals court, then of course, your record can easily be expunged. When a record is "sealed" or expunged, the charges, court files, arrest, detention and initial conviction (before winning an appeal) will be erased from public record. However, a guilty or no contest plea will stay on your record, and if you serve time, then it that will certainly be on your record. In some states, like Florida, a guilty plea or conviction cannot be expunged from public record.

After records are expunged, they will not be available in the public record at the local or state level. Criminal records continue to exist only at the federal level and can be accessed by federal agencies like the Federal Bureau of Investigation (FBI). For example, years after you have served your time or paid your debt to society, you want to apply for a government job that requires security clearance. The governmental agency will do a background search and they will be able to find any prior arrests, convictions, court dates/cases and time served by using the National Crime Information Center (NCIC), which is maintained by the FBI.

Source

 

[Jazzy]

From my experience, felons sometimes can be more trustworthy than people that have no criminal record.

How many felons have you hired and what for what type of work?

 

[DrLeftover]

From my experience, felons sometimes can be more trustworthy than people that have no criminal record.

How many felons have you hired and what for what type of work?

Oh, 'We The People' rehired a few last November to run the country.

 

[DrLeftover]

In this case, the answer to "once a criminal...." is.... probably.

April 25, 2014, 6:05 a.m.

A 14-year-old boy wanted on suspicion of torturing and attempting to kill an 87-year-old woman as she slept in a retirement home in Hemet has been arrested, police said.

Raymond Michael Miranda was tracked to Temecula on Thursday evening and brought back to Hemet, where he was booked into the city jail, Hemet police said in a statement.

Officials said took the unusual step of releasing the boy's photo and identity Thursday "due to the serious nature of the case" and the need for the public's help in tracking the homeless teen down.

Police said they believe that Raymond and a 15-year-old teen somehow broke into the gated retirement home, The Camelot, after committing several acts of vandalism in the area and came upon the sleeping woman. The two teens allegedly brutally beat her and poured bleach on her body before fleeing the scene, police said.

The woman remained in critical condition in an intensive-care unit on Thursday, a week after the attack, according to police.

http://www.latimes.com/local/lanow/la-me-ln-boy-arrested-beating-woman-retirement-home-20140425,0,4879268.story#ixzz2zvi7CUVL

 

[WHO IS SERAFIN]

From my experience, felons sometimes can be more trustworthy than people that have no criminal record.

How many felons have you hired and what for what type of work?

Oh, 'We The People' rehired a few last November to run the country.

So true. Treason, Conspirators, murderers and thugs.

I wish this guy was in my district. He would have my vote on what to do with criminals who do not deserve a second chance.

GOP Florida House candidate on Obama: ‘It’s time to arrest and hang him high’
By David Edwards

Florida GOP candidate Joshua Black (JoshuaBlack2014.com)

Joshua Black, a candidate for Florida House District 68, said on Monday that the time had come to “hang” President Barack Obama.

In a tweet on Monday afternoon, Black wrote that he was “past impeachment.”

“It’s time to arrest and hang him high,” he added.

http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2014/01/21/gop-florida-house-candidate-on-obama-its-time-to-arrest-and-hang-him-high/
[/quote]

 

[DrLeftover]

Like I said, we hired crooks to run the place

25 April 2014
A US congressman is facing criminal charges related to his campaign finances, his lawyer has said.

New York Republican Michael Grimm, elected in 2010, has been under investigation by justice department officials for at least two years.

His lawyer, William McGinley, said the charges were part of a "politically driven vendetta" against his client.

In January, Mr Grimm apologised after threatening to throw a reporter off a balcony in the US Capitol.

The congressman said he would "break" a cable news journalist who brought up an investigation into his campaign funds.

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-27167241