2nd amendment rights for white only?

[TommyTooter]

please don't shoot the messenger here and try to maintain focus on the premise of the meme, being there is a very stark double standard being pointed out. a black man was shot down in a walmart holding a toy gun while telling the cops that it was a toy.

the chances of those police being prosecuted for anything is slim and the chance of them being convicted, if prosecuted is slimmer, with convictions against police officers accused of major felonies running at about 35% as opposed to rates in the high 90's against civilians accused of similar crimes.

 

[Damian]

I don't think this has anything else to do with other than most of the police officers being fat, racist pigs with guns.

 

[DrLeftover]

The story from an Ohio newspaper:

6 august

They believe he was killed possibly after he picked up a toy gun in the store.

Crawford, 22, of Ridge Drive in Fairfield, was identified as the man Beavercreek police shot and killed Tuesday night.

LeeCee Johnson, who said she is the mother of Crawford’s children, said she was on a cell phone call with Crawford when he was shot by officers. She said Crawford went to the area to visit family members.

“We was just talking. He said he was at the video games playing videos and he went over there by the toy section where the toy guns were. And the next thing I know, he said ‘It’s not real,’ and the police start shooting and they said ‘Get on the ground,’ but he was already on the ground because they had shot him,” she said, adding: “And I could hear him just crying and screaming. I feel like they shot him down like he was not even human.”

Beavercreek Police Chief Dennis Evers did not answer questions Wednesday but said officers acted appropriately.

http://www.daytondailynews.com/news/news/man-police-shot-in-walmart-killed-over-fake-gun-fa/ngw77/


More:

BEAVERCREEK, Ohio —

An Ohio man is dead after police are called into a Walmart for reports of a man walking through the store with a rifle. It turns out, a law enforcement source for WHIO said, that it wasn't a real gun but a toy, either a BB or pellet gun, that he had opened at the store Tuesday night.

WHIO reported a couple were in the hardware department when they saw John Crawford walking past them with a rifle pointed toward the sky. They followed Crawford through the store as they called 911 and warned other shoppers to stay away.

One witness, Ronald Ritchie said Crawford "was just waving it at children and people. Items.... I couldn't hear anything that he was saying. I'm thinking that he is either going to rob the place or he's there to shoot somebody else." The man looked kind of serious, Ronald Ritchie said. "He didn't really want to be looked at and when people did look at him, he was pointing the gun at them. He was pointing at people, children walking by."

Ritchie said he wasn't pointing it as if he was going to shoot, but waving it in their direction.

http://www.palmbeachpost.com/news/news/man-holding-realistic-looking-toy-gun-shot-killed-/ngxTX/



"Toy gun" ID

Ohio man was carrying variable pump air rifle — not a toy — when cops killed him: attorney general
John Crawford's girlfriend said that police fatally shot him at a Walmart in Ohio Tuesday while he was holding a toy gun. On Thursday, the Attorney General's Bureau of Criminal Investigation said that the weapon was an MK-177 (.177 caliber) BB/Pellet Rifle, manufactured by Crosman.

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/crime/police-kill-man-air-rifle-walmart-ohio-article-1.1895479

 

[DrLeftover]

please don't shoot the messenger here and try to maintain focus on the premise of the meme, being there is a very stark double standard being pointed out. a black man was shot down in a walmart holding a toy gun while telling the cops that it was a toy.

the chances of those police being prosecuted for anything is slim and the chance of them being convicted, if prosecuted is slimmer, with convictions against police officers accused of major felonies running at about 35% as opposed to rates in the high 90's against civilians accused of similar crimes.

Of course.

The Second Amendment only applies to those that do NOT point weapons at others and when ordered to drop it by uniformed police, they do so instead of arguing

 

[Jazzy]

The shooting occurred after police responded to 911 calls about a man carrying a rifle. In one of those calls, which was released by police, a Wal-Mart shopper told emergency dispatchers that it looked like the man — later identified as Crawford — was trying to load the rifle and that he had pointed it at two children.

The 911 caller’s wife said that Crawford was on the phone and that he was messing with the gun. She said that after police ordered Crawford to put down the unidentified weapon, “I heard two shots after I saw him turn. He still had the weapon in his hand.”

Beavercreek police chief Dennis Evers stood by his officers’ actions, saying that they fired after Crawford failed to comply with their commands to drop the air rifle.

In a statement Thursday, DeWine provided the latest details.

“BCI Investigators on the case report witnesses say the man was carrying a weapon Tuesday night inside a Beavercreek store,” reads DeWine’s statement.

“The weapon was an MK-177 (.177 caliber) BB/Pellet Rifle, manufactured by Crosman. It is known as a ‘variable pump air rifle.’”

Read more

Nothing to do with white vs black. Failure to comply makes this a justifiable shoot. End of story.

 

[Ladyvamptress]

I understand the whole 'possible danger' theory. I get that if cops don't react quickly, innocent people could be caught up in the mix and killed. However, I've always said that giving the cops the power to use deadly force is wrong. Bean bag guns hurt like hell, so do rubber bullets. Was about a taser? It seems to me that cops go to the extreme to take down a potential danger. Shoot first, then ask questions later. Problem with that is that cops don't shoot to wound anymore, they shoot to kill and then there isn't anyone to ask questions to other than people who only THINK they know the truth. I noticed his girlfriend said that he was in the toy section and it was a toy gun he had, other sources say he had a BB gun, which are not toys and they are not even sold in the toy section (try sporting goods, along with paint ball guns). We will never know if his girlfriend was right or if this was a cover up. Who knows if he really had a toy gun or a BB gun? Instead of shooting him in the arm which held the gun and then cuffing him and taking him to the station to be questioned, they shot him dead and we will never know the whole story. I don't agree with people being allowed to have gun in the first place, but that's a whole other subject. There are so many things out there other than guns with real bullets that can stop people from doing harm.

I remember a year or so back, a black man... clearly deranged was cornered by 5 local cops here and he started waving a butcher knife around. Instead of those 5 cops working together to disarm and arrest the man, they all just open fired on him, couple of the officers popped off more than 1 round into the man. Now I was always told that you never bring a knife to a gun fight, but this man was no match for those cops to start with, why did it come down to them shooting him several times with real bullets to stop him? Of course there was an investigation... but I personally never heard what was found. In my mind, those cops should be kicked off the force if they couldn't even take down 1 man with a knife, WITHOUT using deadly force.

I don't think it's a case of black and white really. I know it seems that way cause we hear about the black people gunned down a lot more, but that's media for you! I'm sure there are plenty of white people who get shot for little to no reason. In my opinion, I think this is a matter of cops abusing the power they are given. Not all cops are bad, but it only take one bad egg to make the rest look bad.

 

[Damian]

I understand the whole 'possible danger' theory. I get that if cops don't react quickly, innocent people could be caught up in the mix and killed. However, I've always said that giving the cops the power to use deadly force is wrong. Bean bag guns hurt like hell, so do rubber bullets. Was about a taser? It seems to me that cops go to the extreme to take down a potential danger. Shoot first, then ask questions later. Problem with that is that cops don't shoot to wound anymore, they shoot to kill and then there isn't anyone to ask questions to other than people who only THINK they know the truth. I noticed his girlfriend said that he was in the toy section and it was a toy gun he had, other sources say he had a BB gun, which are not toys and they are not even sold in the toy section (try sporting goods, along with paint ball guns). We will never know if his girlfriend was right or if this was a cover up. Who knows if he really had a toy gun or a BB gun? Instead of shooting him in the arm which held the gun and then cuffing him and taking him to the station to be questioned, they shot him dead and we will never know the whole story. I don't agree with people being allowed to have gun in the first place, but that's a whole other subject. There are so many things out there other than guns with real bullets that can stop people from doing harm.

I remember a year or so back, a black man... clearly deranged was cornered by 5 local cops here and he started waving a butcher knife around. Instead of those 5 cops working together to disarm and arrest the man, they all just open fired on him, couple of the officers popped off more than 1 round into the man. Now I was always told that you never bring a knife to a gun fight, but this man was no match for those cops to start with, why did it come down to them shooting him several times with real bullets to stop him? Of course there was an investigation... but I personally never heard what was found. In my mind, those cops should be kicked off the force if they couldn't even take down 1 man with a knife, WITHOUT using deadly force.

I don't think it's a case of black and white really. I know it seems that way cause we hear about the black people gunned down a lot more, but that's media for you! I'm sure there are plenty of white people who get shot for little to no reason. In my opinion, I think this is a matter of cops abusing the power they are given. Not all cops are bad, but it only take one bad egg to make the rest look bad.

I agree with you but there are plenty of cases of violent cops injuring, hurting, insulting, taking advantage and even killing people for no real reason at all. What woudn't I give to see those bastards spending the rest of their lives in prison. I'm sure their fellow inmates would treat them well.

 

[Ladyvamptress]

I agree with you but there are plenty of cases of violent cops injuring, hurting, insulting, taking advantage and even killing people for no real reason at all. What woudn't I give to see those bastards spending the rest of their lives in prison. I'm sure their fellow inmates would treat them well.

I don't doubt it. The whole law system is flawed and it's getting worse and worse.

 

[TommyTooter]

at one time, municipal police in america had to take every effort possible effort to avoid discharging their weapons. this has changed in recent years and the statistics clearly show that black people and dogs get shot a lot more than white folk.

then there's the blue line that closes around the shooter who will spare no effort to paint the scenario in a light that will justify the shooting.


http://www.nytimes.com/2013/02/03/opinion/sunday/why-police-officers-lie-under-oath.html?pagewanted=all&_r=0

But are police officers necessarily more trustworthy than alleged criminals? I think not. Not just because the police have a special inclination toward confabulation, but because, disturbingly, they have an incentive to lie. In this era of mass incarceration, the police shouldn’t be trusted any more than any other witness, perhaps less so.

That may sound harsh, but numerous law enforcement officials have put the matter more bluntly. Peter Keane, a former San Francisco Police commissioner, wrote an article in The San Francisco Chronicle decrying a police culture that treats lying as the norm: “Police officer perjury in court to justify illegal dope searches is commonplace. One of the dirty little not-so-secret secrets of the criminal justice system is undercover narcotics officers intentionally lying under oath. It is a perversion of the American justice system that strikes directly at the rule of law. Yet it is the routine way of doing business in courtrooms everywhere in America.”

 

[DrLeftover]

Nothing to do with white vs black. Failure to comply makes this a justifiable shoot. End of story.

Not to those that have their own anti-police (in each, every, and all cases regardless of situation) agenda for reasons of their own.

 

[TommyTooter]

i'm going to withhold any opinion about whether or not this shooting was justified. there are some very serious discrepancies in witness accounts. nobody saw crawford as any kind of threat except the couple, one a former marine, who called 911.

it also seems that the police fired before they ordered crawford to put down the weapon and he was on the phone at the time he was shot.

Dayton-Area Walmart Shooting: Was An Innocent Man SWATted to Death?

here's a very typical outcome in a similar case:

No Charges For California Deputy That Killed Boy Carrying Airsoft Rifle

this is a very interesting opinion piece from the pro gun side laying the blame on the witness and the anti-gun culture.

Walmart Shopper Shot While Handling Air Rifle

 

[Fatal Dawn]

Nothing to do with white vs black. Failure to comply makes this a justifiable shoot. End of story.

Not to those that have their own anti-police (in each, every, and all cases regardless of situation) agenda for reasons of their own.

Police have been known to use excessive force even when the situation doesn't call for it. A lot of them take advantage of their power when targeting certain people. It's not an anti-police agenda; a lot of them actually act this way.

 

[TommyTooter]

Nothing to do with white vs black. Failure to comply makes this a justifiable shoot. End of story.

Not to those that have their own anti-police (in each, every, and all cases regardless of situation) agenda for reasons of their own.

Police have been known to use excessive force even when the situation doesn't call for it. A lot of them take advantage of their power when targeting certain people. It's not an anti-police agenda; a lot of them actually act this way.

the militarization of municipal police departments has been accompanied by a steady increase in police violence against civilians, with over 5,000 people killed by police since 9/11. there is a disproportionate number of non-whites being killed and brutalized, but this isn't necessarily racially-motivated. i've seen non-white police brutalize non-whites. the whole albuqerque police department is currently being accused of being excessively violent.



http://alibi.com/feature/46243/Life-and-Death-and-APD.html

 

[Fatal Dawn]

It's weird how the APD looks at each incidence in isolation instead of part of a pattern of police violence. I agree that motivation isn't always racially-motivated.I think some officers, not all, but some, are not able to distinguish between what is necessary force and what is excessive.

As it relates to the second amendment and race.. The second amendment has an interesting role in black history. Especially during the Jim Crow era when there was constant threat of violence to person by White supremacist groups like the KKK. The right to bear arms was one of those civil liberties that was suppressed because of the fear of an armed resistance - or, more specifically, a black armed resistance. Later on you had those who took that notion of self-defense to a more extreme level, such as this man:

The conditions have changed today where guns are used to perpetuate black-on-black violence and inner-city strife than self-protection. This is probably where negative perception of black gun ownership comes from (and yes I do believe there are racial differences in gun ownership perception).

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zNktEtEQpDM

 

[WHO IS SERAFIN]

please don't shoot the messenger here and try to maintain focus on the premise of the meme, being there is a very stark double standard being pointed out. a black man was shot down in a walmart holding a toy gun while telling the cops that it was a toy.

the chances of those police being prosecuted for anything is slim and the chance of them being convicted, if prosecuted is slimmer, with convictions against police officers accused of major felonies running at about 35% as opposed to rates in the high 90's against civilians accused of similar crimes.

This is nonsense. The black population is what 17% of the population but yet they commit over 50% of the countries crimes. But that being said gun rights helps the innocent black population more then the rest of us.

Blacks benefit from Florida ‘Stand Your Ground’ law at disproportionate rate
African Americans benefit from Florida’s “Stand Your Ground” self-defense law at a rate far out of proportion to their presence in the state’s population, despite an assertion by Attorney General Eric Holder that repealing “Stand Your Ground” would help African Americans.

Black Floridians have made about a third of the state’s total “Stand Your Ground” claims in homicide cases, a rate nearly double the black percentage of Florida’s population. The majority of those claims have been successful, a success rate that exceeds that for Florida whites.

Nonetheless, prominent African Americans including Holder and “Ebony and Ivory” singer Stevie Wonder, who has vowed not to perform in the Sunshine State until the law is revoked, have made “Stand Your Ground” a central part of the Trayvon Martin controversy. http://dailycaller.com/2013/07/16/blacks-benefit-from-florida-stand-your-ground-law-at-disproportionate-rate/

 

[TommyTooter]

please don't shoot the messenger here and try to maintain focus on the premise of the meme, being there is a very stark double standard being pointed out. a black man was shot down in a walmart holding a toy gun while telling the cops that it was a toy.

the chances of those police being prosecuted for anything is slim and the chance of them being convicted, if prosecuted is slimmer, with convictions against police officers accused of major felonies running at about 35% as opposed to rates in the high 90's against civilians accused of similar crimes.

This is nonsense. The black population is what 17% of the population but yet they commit over 50% of the countries crimes. But that being said gun rights helps the innocent black population more then the rest of us.

Blacks benefit from Florida ‘Stand Your Ground’ law at disproportionate rate
African Americans benefit from Florida’s “Stand Your Ground” self-defense law at a rate far out of proportion to their presence in the state’s population, despite an assertion by Attorney General Eric Holder that repealing “Stand Your Ground” would help African Americans.

Black Floridians have made about a third of the state’s total “Stand Your Ground” claims in homicide cases, a rate nearly double the black percentage of Florida’s population. The majority of those claims have been successful, a success rate that exceeds that for Florida whites.

Nonetheless, prominent African Americans including Holder and “Ebony and Ivory” singer Stevie Wonder, who has vowed not to perform in the Sunshine State until the law is revoked, have made “Stand Your Ground” a central part of the Trayvon Martin controversy. http://dailycaller.com/2013/07/16/blacks-benefit-from-florida-stand-your-ground-law-at-disproportionate-rate/

when you cite statistics like that, you need to link your sources please, or it's just ass smoke. i really don't want to get into this particular aspect of the argument with anybody blowing ass smoke in numbers like that. please back your opinions on this with facts. i'm not taking any position about black crime vs white crime or justice meted out to blacks as opposed to whites without the numbers from reliable sources.

my issue with the whole scenario is the lack of prosecution against a seemingly steady increase in police who commit felonies against civilians, walk away with hardly a slap on the wrist and then the taxpayers end up burdened with paying the settlement on the victim's family's civil complaint.

 

[WHO IS SERAFIN]

please don't shoot the messenger here and try to maintain focus on the premise of the meme, being there is a very stark double standard being pointed out. a black man was shot down in a walmart holding a toy gun while telling the cops that it was a toy.

the chances of those police being prosecuted for anything is slim and the chance of them being convicted, if prosecuted is slimmer, with convictions against police officers accused of major felonies running at about 35% as opposed to rates in the high 90's against civilians accused of similar crimes.

This is nonsense. The black population is what 17% of the population but yet they commit over 50% of the countries crimes. But that being said gun rights helps the innocent black population more then the rest of us.

Blacks benefit from Florida ‘Stand Your Ground’ law at disproportionate rate
African Americans benefit from Florida’s “Stand Your Ground” self-defense law at a rate far out of proportion to their presence in the state’s population, despite an assertion by Attorney General Eric Holder that repealing “Stand Your Ground” would help African Americans.

Black Floridians have made about a third of the state’s total “Stand Your Ground” claims in homicide cases, a rate nearly double the black percentage of Florida’s population. The majority of those claims have been successful, a success rate that exceeds that for Florida whites.

Nonetheless, prominent African Americans including Holder and “Ebony and Ivory” singer Stevie Wonder, who has vowed not to perform in the Sunshine State until the law is revoked, have made “Stand Your Ground” a central part of the Trayvon Martin controversy. http://dailycaller.com/2013/07/16/blacks-benefit-from-florida-stand-your-ground-law-at-disproportionate-rate/

when you cite statistics like that, you need to link your sources please, or it's just ass smoke. i really don't want to get into this particular aspect of the argument with anybody blowing ass smoke in numbers like that. please back your opinions on this with facts. i'm not taking any position about black crime vs white crime or justice meted out to blacks as opposed to whites without the numbers from reliable sources.

my issue with the whole scenario is the lack of prosecution against a seemingly steady increase in police who commit felonies against civilians, walk away with hardly a slap on the wrist and then the taxpayers end up burdened with paying the settlement on the victim's family's civil complaint.

With you I dont care what kind of smoke you think it is. If you dont like it prove me wrong with google or do not. Anyways the link proves the 2nd amendment is very important and works in protecting the black law abiding citizens. The nonsense about racism on every corner is played out and just no working anymore on people.

 

[TommyTooter]

please don't shoot the messenger here and try to maintain focus on the premise of the meme, being there is a very stark double standard being pointed out. a black man was shot down in a walmart holding a toy gun while telling the cops that it was a toy.

the chances of those police being prosecuted for anything is slim and the chance of them being convicted, if prosecuted is slimmer, with convictions against police officers accused of major felonies running at about 35% as opposed to rates in the high 90's against civilians accused of similar crimes.

This is nonsense. The black population is what 17% of the population but yet they commit over 50% of the countries crimes. But that being said gun rights helps the innocent black population more then the rest of us.

Blacks benefit from Florida ‘Stand Your Ground’ law at disproportionate rate
African Americans benefit from Florida’s “Stand Your Ground” self-defense law at a rate far out of proportion to their presence in the state’s population, despite an assertion by Attorney General Eric Holder that repealing “Stand Your Ground” would help African Americans.

Black Floridians have made about a third of the state’s total “Stand Your Ground” claims in homicide cases, a rate nearly double the black percentage of Florida’s population. The majority of those claims have been successful, a success rate that exceeds that for Florida whites.

Nonetheless, prominent African Americans including Holder and “Ebony and Ivory” singer Stevie Wonder, who has vowed not to perform in the Sunshine State until the law is revoked, have made “Stand Your Ground” a central part of the Trayvon Martin controversy. http://dailycaller.com/2013/07/16/blacks-benefit-from-florida-stand-your-ground-law-at-disproportionate-rate/

when you cite statistics like that, you need to link your sources please, or it's just ass smoke. i really don't want to get into this particular aspect of the argument with anybody blowing ass smoke in numbers like that. please back your opinions on this with facts. i'm not taking any position about black crime vs white crime or justice meted out to blacks as opposed to whites without the numbers from reliable sources.

my issue with the whole scenario is the lack of prosecution against a seemingly steady increase in police who commit felonies against civilians, walk away with hardly a slap on the wrist and then the taxpayers end up burdened with paying the settlement on the victim's family's civil complaint.

With you I dont care what kind of smoke you think it is. If you dont like it prove me wrong with google or do not. Anyways the link proves the 2nd amendment is very important and works in protecting the black law abiding citizens. The nonsense about racism on every corner is played out and just no working anymore on people.

nothing says "i am a mentally conditioned moron" more than a response like you just gave. back your opinions with facts or keep them out of my face, please. i absolutely refuse to do your research for you unless you're going to pay me for my time. i charge $50/hr for that kind of research with a 4 hour minimum.

opinions are like assholes. everybody has at least one and they most often stink. unless you can back your assertions with fact , you have proved nothing and i am under no obligation to refute a damn thing.

 

[WHO IS SERAFIN]

please don't shoot the messenger here and try to maintain focus on the premise of the meme, being there is a very stark double standard being pointed out. a black man was shot down in a walmart holding a toy gun while telling the cops that it was a toy.

the chances of those police being prosecuted for anything is slim and the chance of them being convicted, if prosecuted is slimmer, with convictions against police officers accused of major felonies running at about 35% as opposed to rates in the high 90's against civilians accused of similar crimes.

This is nonsense. The black population is what 17% of the population but yet they commit over 50% of the countries crimes. But that being said gun rights helps the innocent black population more then the rest of us.

Blacks benefit from Florida ‘Stand Your Ground’ law at disproportionate rate
African Americans benefit from Florida’s “Stand Your Ground” self-defense law at a rate far out of proportion to their presence in the state’s population, despite an assertion by Attorney General Eric Holder that repealing “Stand Your Ground” would help African Americans.

Black Floridians have made about a third of the state’s total “Stand Your Ground” claims in homicide cases, a rate nearly double the black percentage of Florida’s population. The majority of those claims have been successful, a success rate that exceeds that for Florida whites.

Nonetheless, prominent African Americans including Holder and “Ebony and Ivory” singer Stevie Wonder, who has vowed not to perform in the Sunshine State until the law is revoked, have made “Stand Your Ground” a central part of the Trayvon Martin controversy. http://dailycaller.com/2013/07/16/blacks-benefit-from-florida-stand-your-ground-law-at-disproportionate-rate/

when you cite statistics like that, you need to link your sources please, or it's just ass smoke. i really don't want to get into this particular aspect of the argument with anybody blowing ass smoke in numbers like that. please back your opinions on this with facts. i'm not taking any position about black crime vs white crime or justice meted out to blacks as opposed to whites without the numbers from reliable sources.

my issue with the whole scenario is the lack of prosecution against a seemingly steady increase in police who commit felonies against civilians, walk away with hardly a slap on the wrist and then the taxpayers end up burdened with paying the settlement on the victim's family's civil complaint.

With you I dont care what kind of smoke you think it is. If you dont like it prove me wrong with google or do not. Anyways the link proves the 2nd amendment is very important and works in protecting the black law abiding citizens. The nonsense about racism on every corner is played out and just no working anymore on people.

nothing says "i am a mentally conditioned moron" more than a response like you just gave. back your opinions with facts or keep them out of my face, please. i absolutely refuse to do your research for you unless you're going to pay me for my time. i charge $50/hr for that kind of research with a 4 hour minimum.

opinions are like assholes. everybody has at least one and they most often stink. unless you can back your assertions with fact , you have proved nothing and i am under no obligation to refute a damn thing.

Why thank you good to see people are noticing my five days a week workout conditioning is paying off. You made my day!


They are facts until you prove otherwise. And it will continue to be in your face. But great job avoiding the link on how gun rights protect not harm law abiding black Americans.

Oh! Apologies the black population is not 17% percent it is between 12 and 14%.

 

[TommyTooter]

please don't shoot the messenger here and try to maintain focus on the premise of the meme, being there is a very stark double standard being pointed out. a black man was shot down in a walmart holding a toy gun while telling the cops that it was a toy.

the chances of those police being prosecuted for anything is slim and the chance of them being convicted, if prosecuted is slimmer, with convictions against police officers accused of major felonies running at about 35% as opposed to rates in the high 90's against civilians accused of similar crimes.

This is nonsense. The black population is what 17% of the population but yet they commit over 50% of the countries crimes. But that being said gun rights helps the innocent black population more then the rest of us.

Blacks benefit from Florida ‘Stand Your Ground’ law at disproportionate rate
African Americans benefit from Florida’s “Stand Your Ground” self-defense law at a rate far out of proportion to their presence in the state’s population, despite an assertion by Attorney General Eric Holder that repealing “Stand Your Ground” would help African Americans.

Black Floridians have made about a third of the state’s total “Stand Your Ground” claims in homicide cases, a rate nearly double the black percentage of Florida’s population. The majority of those claims have been successful, a success rate that exceeds that for Florida whites.

Nonetheless, prominent African Americans including Holder and “Ebony and Ivory” singer Stevie Wonder, who has vowed not to perform in the Sunshine State until the law is revoked, have made “Stand Your Ground” a central part of the Trayvon Martin controversy. http://dailycaller.com/2013/07/16/blacks-benefit-from-florida-stand-your-ground-law-at-disproportionate-rate/

when you cite statistics like that, you need to link your sources please, or it's just ass smoke. i really don't want to get into this particular aspect of the argument with anybody blowing ass smoke in numbers like that. please back your opinions on this with facts. i'm not taking any position about black crime vs white crime or justice meted out to blacks as opposed to whites without the numbers from reliable sources.

my issue with the whole scenario is the lack of prosecution against a seemingly steady increase in police who commit felonies against civilians, walk away with hardly a slap on the wrist and then the taxpayers end up burdened with paying the settlement on the victim's family's civil complaint.

With you I dont care what kind of smoke you think it is. If you dont like it prove me wrong with google or do not. Anyways the link proves the 2nd amendment is very important and works in protecting the black law abiding citizens. The nonsense about racism on every corner is played out and just no working anymore on people.

nothing says "i am a mentally conditioned moron" more than a response like you just gave. back your opinions with facts or keep them out of my face, please. i absolutely refuse to do your research for you unless you're going to pay me for my time. i charge $50/hr for that kind of research with a 4 hour minimum.

opinions are like assholes. everybody has at least one and they most often stink. unless you can back your assertions with fact , you have proved nothing and i am under no obligation to refute a damn thing.

Why thank you good to see people are noticing my five days a week workout conditioning is paying off. You made my day!


They are facts until you prove otherwise. And it will continue to be in your face. But great job avoiding the link on how gun rights protect not harm law abiding black Americans.

Oh! Apologies the black population is not 17% percent it is between 12 and 14%.

you're amazingly stupid, dude and your link is off topic. you have posted undocumented statistics with an opinion. it remains that until you support your argument. it's not incumbent on me to disprove something that you have merely asserted with no support. show your proof or back out of this discussion like the intelligent, mature human you obviously aren't.