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Men & Women
- Thread starter Randy
- Start date
I think we as a culture expect women to have a career AND be a caregiver at home (taking care of the kids, cooking, etc). All that is expected of a man is that he has a job. If he helps out with the house work and kids, then he is considered to be a great-husband and father. However the woman doesn't get the same recognition for doing the same thing as society expects it of her.
Equality is a tough one to put a number on. I'm inclined to say no - especially if you take a global view, there is still plenty of areas where gender inequality is appalling. I think, however, I am seeing a trend now, the start of one at least, which is the opposite of what Nebulous is describing. The gender 'roles' are switching, and I think soon we'll see women firmly in the role men were once in, and men in a role that women were in. There will be some biological realities that are unavoidable, but socially, at least I'm seeing a change.
Maleââ¬âfemale income disparity, also referred to as the gender gap in earnings in the United States, and as the gender wage gap, the gender earnings gap and the gender pay gap, refers usually to the ratio of female to male median yearly earnings among full-time, year-round (FTYR) workers. The statistic is used by government agencies and economists, and is gathered by the U.S. Census Bureau, as part of the Current Population Survey.
Gee, can you guess what my answers would be to the questions asked by the OP?
FACTS resource link: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Male–female_income_disparity_in_the_United_States
Gee, can you guess what my answers would be to the questions asked by the OP?
FACTS resource link: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Male–female_income_disparity_in_the_United_States
Jazzy, you do realize that gap is dissapearing rapidly? A lot of it has to do with disparity in education and choice of jobs.. (not as many female engineers just like there aren't as many male nurses). Here's a quote from the Wikipedia article you posted.
In a 2009 report titled Women's Earnings in 2008, the U.S. Labor Department reported women's median wages to be 79.9% of men's. Moreover, the report found that women who have never married earn 94.2% of their unmarried male counterparts' earnings despite the fact that, women, still..are more likely to choose jobs in education and healthcare, where earnings will tend to be lower. The earnings difference between women and men varies with age, with younger women more closely approaching pay equity than older women. Since women without children tend to be younger (in 2006, more than 85% of American women had their first child before the age of 35), the wage gap is smallest for them. In 2008, the average wage gap for all age groups was 77.1%
In 2009, it was reported that sixteen women heading companies in the Standard & Poorââ¬â¢s 500 Index averaged earnings of $14.2 million in their latest fiscal years, 43 percent more than the male average, according to data compiled by Bloomberg News from proxy filings. The women who were also CEOs in 2008 got a 19 percent raise in 2009ââ¬âwhile the men took a 5 percent cut. Bloomberg's Deirdre Bolton reports.
In a 2009 report titled Women's Earnings in 2008, the U.S. Labor Department reported women's median wages to be 79.9% of men's. Moreover, the report found that women who have never married earn 94.2% of their unmarried male counterparts' earnings despite the fact that, women, still..are more likely to choose jobs in education and healthcare, where earnings will tend to be lower. The earnings difference between women and men varies with age, with younger women more closely approaching pay equity than older women. Since women without children tend to be younger (in 2006, more than 85% of American women had their first child before the age of 35), the wage gap is smallest for them. In 2008, the average wage gap for all age groups was 77.1%
In 2009, it was reported that sixteen women heading companies in the Standard & Poorââ¬â¢s 500 Index averaged earnings of $14.2 million in their latest fiscal years, 43 percent more than the male average, according to data compiled by Bloomberg News from proxy filings. The women who were also CEOs in 2008 got a 19 percent raise in 2009ââ¬âwhile the men took a 5 percent cut. Bloomberg's Deirdre Bolton reports.
Temerit said:
Yes, this is what I was alluding to.
Jazzy said:
I don't think we'll ever see gender quality, nor legit pay for childcare. The problem is, there have been social revolutions to overthrow a current social regime or another, and revolutions don't result in equality, they result in a displacement and replacement. These social revolutions have only been really had in Western Hemispheric nations for the most part - so while the Female is on the rise and eventually to the top in that region of the world - there is a lot to be done for Feminism in other regions. Unfortunately, packaged with this social change (well the inertia of it), which could have brought about equality - was a good dose of misandry, and thus instead of a liberation, there instead came a revolution.
Being a homemaker/caring for a child is in the nebulous spot of being considered non-productive/non-gainful activity. That's a product of a Social Darwinist Hyper-Capitalist approach to social roles and applying value to different things. Taking care of your baby and keeping your home together doesn't make someone a profit, and often dilutes their profit, so it isn't worth anything to someone who invests money, and thus doesn't get paid. As long as such a regime of thought and socio-economic administration is in place, homemaking won't be paid a la a career.
Durandal said:
In your area or all over the world?
The stay at home dad is far less common than the stay at home mom. Men by instinct feel the need to provide for their family (like a cave man would go hunt and gather
Nebulous said:In your area or all over the world?
The stay at home dad is far less common than the stay at home mom. Men by instinct feel the need to provide for their family (like a cave man would go hunt and gather).
Well my first point mentioned, globally, but I moved on to say more or less the inertia of the social revolution applied to Western Hemispheric nations for the most part..
Change doesn't mean absolute, nor complete - it's a process still, and so yes, still much less common for men to stay at home, but it is changing and the index for the future change is trending toward a switch. Other much more subtle and complicated things are tangent, but applicable to such, but outside of the scope of the conversation, I think. I think the 'Caveman Instinct' is overstated and overused - there is societal pressure and leverage against doing atypical social roles, but that is dwindling.
Nebulous said:I didn't know you could predict the future.
Also the discussion is about in this day and age / current times.
Which I addressed - I merely added an aside that I think from this day and age things will move in a particular direction...
I was going to point out the legal and societal standing of women in nations under Sharia.... but I decided against it.
It depends on what you mean by equality. Like said in previous posts by Durandal and Temerit, the gap between men and women on a social level is becoming smaller by the day. The change is already very clear when you look at the many female politicians nowadays and I don't think it'll take long before women get paid just as much as men do. So when it comes to rights and chances in life, I think equality isn't far away. Though I think people should accept that men and women will always be different and society will always expect different things from them (for example the way they dress).
When you look at a global level, it's still very far away. Female circumcision and lapidation for cheating on the husband are a few of the more extreme examples that come to mind here.
I don't agree when saying that men and women are switching places. While I understand why it's been said, I think it's too early to draw that conclusion.
When you look at a global level, it's still very far away. Female circumcision and lapidation for cheating on the husband are a few of the more extreme examples that come to mind here.
I don't agree when saying that men and women are switching places. While I understand why it's been said, I think it's too early to draw that conclusion.
I know that affirmation actions within post-secondary educational institutions has resulted in a huge shift in the percentage of the respective sexes that attend college. It has gone from the vast majority having been male in the 1950s. Now there are more women at almost every university and many more overall. Many of these women go out and get degrees, but then become a stay at home mom (they don't use their degrees). My mom is in this boat, she worked for around six or seven years after college and then hasn't worked for the past twenty years.
There is also a lot of bullshit that goes on in the courtroom, stuff that was intended to protect women has now made the world a scary place to be a teenage guy. My uncle is a pediatrician, and he talks to a lot of his patients, and he has also testified in courts in a few cases concerning sexually deviant behavior. He knew a teenage guy who was sent to jail for multiple years and labeled a sex offender for mooning a girl, because someone told a teacher and she had said that she saw his junk.
In another case a girl was friends with a guy and she brought him over to her house, she then got out some of her parent's alcohol and they got drunk, and ended up having sex. After the ordeal, once she had told someone and was sent into counseling, where she was egged on by a group of sick people to believe that she had been raped. She ended up testifying in court that she had been raped and there was nothing the boy could do. He was hauled off to jail and labeled a sex offender as well.
There is also a lot of bullshit that goes on in the courtroom, stuff that was intended to protect women has now made the world a scary place to be a teenage guy. My uncle is a pediatrician, and he talks to a lot of his patients, and he has also testified in courts in a few cases concerning sexually deviant behavior. He knew a teenage guy who was sent to jail for multiple years and labeled a sex offender for mooning a girl, because someone told a teacher and she had said that she saw his junk.
In another case a girl was friends with a guy and she brought him over to her house, she then got out some of her parent's alcohol and they got drunk, and ended up having sex. After the ordeal, once she had told someone and was sent into counseling, where she was egged on by a group of sick people to believe that she had been raped. She ended up testifying in court that she had been raped and there was nothing the boy could do. He was hauled off to jail and labeled a sex offender as well.
